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Griff: [00:00:00] my parents split when I was one. I just had a lot of time alone. So I think that I would spend that time outside building trails or making little skate videos or skating in the street canoe and rock climb and do all those things. . So I think all that alone time was really helpful for me to just kinda stay busy creatively. , Ironically my parents got back together 16 years later.

Paddy: Really,

Griff: yeah.

Paddy: this is the plot of a lovely rom-com.

Griff: I say we had nothing to do with it.

Paddy: Did you parent trap your parents

Griff: Potentially I had an acoustic coffee house show. I was like 16, 17. They had just kind of gotten out of relationships of their own and we're both single and they got to talking at this coffee table

Paddy: This song goes out to my parents. It's called In Your Eyes by Peter Gabriel. And I'm gonna play it three times in a row.

Griff: Yeah.

Paddy: Okay, can the next YouTube Goth Babe video, please be this story recreated with cardboard

Griff: Yeah,

MUSIC

PADDY INTRO VO:

Hold on tight, I'm about [00:01:00] to blow your minds. Did you know that gas will expand infinitely to fill any space? That may explain your sleeping bag ballooning after your last campfire-cooked chimichanga. Ahem. Did you know that a human being traveling through a black hole will be stretched to the width of a single atom-wide as they pass through? Did you know the universe is constantly expanding at a rate that is constantly increasing? Or that weather is created by atmospheric high and low pressures seeking equilibrium in a  climate tango? Well, ya do now. What does this have to do with a podcast about the surprising impacts of a life outside? Thank you for asking, pals.

This physical phenomenon, where … stuff expands and contracts and moves in response to the space it’s in, is a tidy metaphor for Griff Washburn, AKA Goth Babe. Washburn, or as I like to call him, Babe, has [00:02:00] spent his life moving from different spacial contexts — big cities to small towns, mountains to beaches, homes to campers. With every evolution, his music has shifted and expanded to fill these spaces...but I also like to think that first the music expanded inside of him until it burst out the seams and filled the world for booties to groove.

PAUSE PAUSE

Griff Washburn was born and raised in Memphis, Tenessee. And from the jump, he had an itch to create and to move. His drive to make things was so well known that his childhood neighbors would drop off their used cardboard boxes at his home so he could transform them. When he wasn't using his hands, he was using his feet. He ran amok in the woods, skateboarded, rode his bike on self-built tracks. He picked up a guitar when he was a teenager and so began Goth Babe.

[00:03:00] Griff's creative drive has also led him to a lot of actual driving. He's moved from Nashville to New York to LA to Oregon to Washington, all in pursuit of space to create and room to roam outside, traveling and living in self -built-out vans, truck bed campers, a tiny home on a trailer, even a flippin' sail boat. And he's documented these DIY projects on his very robust YouTube Channel. But in 2021, Griff suffered a brutal brain injury while surfing that threatened to completely sufficate his music career, his adventures, and the exapansion and evolution of both. Luckily for Griff, and for us - the Goth Babe booty groovers - when life contracts so severely, inevitably, it is forced to brilliantly.expand.

MUSIC

Paddy: First things first, what's your last humbling and or hilarious moment outside?

Griff: So I was just in Bend, Oregon and I was doing a video for their tourism board, I was trying to kind of highlight that [00:04:00] Bend has all four seasons, and I had a buddy that was filming me and I was kind of standing out in the woods with my arms wide open, just a few steps off of a mountain bike trail.

I have all four sets of outfits like summer, spring, fall, and winter.

Paddy: To do like jump cuts between. Okay, cool.

Griff: I'd do a twirl and I'd throw all the clothes off real quick.

He'd throw me the new outfit and I'd put it on and I'm like, in my underwear in between. And there was like a Forest service truck driving by. And I just had to like, sun's going down. All right, Griff, this is what you gotta do. Just keep your head down

Paddy: I, I'm making, I'm making a video to get more people here.

Griff: Yeah,

Paddy: We're not weirdos, I promise.

Griff: Totally. You're welcome. Or, I'm sorry.

Paddy: Yeah. Totally. Yeah, totally. Oh my god.

Griff: Does that count? Is that a humbling

Paddy: That is, that definitely counts because Lord knows whoever was driving that forest service truck, went back to the shop and was like, you guys.

Griff: Influencers are getting crazy

Paddy: I gotta tell you what I just saw out in the [00:05:00] woods.

Griff: it's another day in Bend.

Paddy: Totally. Man. You know what Bend is really keeping it weird. All right. let's get into it.

PUASE PAUSE PAUSE

You strike me. as a searcher, as an adventurer, a purposeful wanderer, and a tinkerer.

Your YouTube page is like the combination of music, Wes Anderson and this old house with Bob Vela. And I want you to know that is a giant compliment

Griff: that is a giant compliment. Thank you.

Paddy: All of these characteristics, all of these things, they come out in your music. Is that a fair assessment, you think?

Griff: Yeah. I love that. That's a humongous compliment.

Paddy: Well I'm just trying to butter you up until I just like come at you real hard.

Griff: Slaughter me. Yep. Uh, yeah, I think so. Like, I live in a pretty small town and I think this place allows me to explore all those little, creative parts of my mind., i'm just trying to like return to being a kiddo I made a bunch of videos as a kid, skateboarding and that's kind of how I got into [00:06:00] music through, you know, skaters listen to like alternative rock, so it's kind of funny how it's been full circle. Like skateboarding videos got me into music now.

Music is kind of like returning me to making little movies and it's felt cool to have the outlet of YouTube and making movies 'cause there's no pressure, there's no Spotify monthly listeners, there's no record label, there's none of that stuff.

I feel like I've gone through all these different stages of my creativity and right now I'm like so psyched on where I'm creatively.

Paddy: The interesting thing that you said there, that you passed by quickly, is you were just trying to return to this childlike state. I think a lot of the time we can trace the seeds of our adult passions back to our childhood. Like I can trace my lifelong love affair with story and storytelling back to a few things from when I was but a wee un-mustached child.

you know, like I loved going to Blockbuster and losing myself in the stacks of films and picking out a film for the weekend. I also loved playing with action figures. You know, make these little, , hero's journeys for [00:07:00] my GI Joes and these intricate backstories for my X-Men figures. I built these little worlds, and I lost myself in them.

And I can trace that from there to here of how I spend my time, but also what my career path is. In regards to your love affair with creating music, do you trace it back to those little creations you made out of old cardboard boxes when you were a kid?

Griff: You did your homework. Dang. You're too good, man. I appreciate that.

Paddy: Dude, I've been, going through your trash whilst you slumber.

Griff: A hundred percent yes, for sure.

Paddy: What were you making out of these old boxes

Griff: the dream as a kid would've been to get a refrigerator, cardboard box.

Paddy: best. Right? Instant Fort Instant spaceship.

Griff: put windows in there, you could put doors in there. You could put other cardboard boxes in that cardboard box.

Paddy: This box fits boxes.

Griff: Yeah. Uh, I remember making a con, uh, what's it called? Like a, it has a claw and you can like get candy and things like that out of [00:08:00] it.

Paddy: The like grab 'em thing at like any arcade, right? Where the claw

Griff: Yeah. Yeah.

Paddy: what they're called. Just the claw,

Griff: yeah, I built one of those.

Paddy: Like with a working claw.

Griff: certainly not. It was like a little scooper instead of a claw. But I put money into it and have candy in there. I, I remember making laptops. I could just be a piece of cardboard folded in half with some keys on it and things like that.

Paddy: So you could like cosplay, answering emails

Griff: for sure. And now I hate answering emails, so I'm glad I got it all out of the way.

I mean, being in school I did not pay attention 'cause I was just thinking about projects or little creative ideas I had at back at home that I'd get out, let out at three and go finish 'em. We didn't have a very big backyard and I would always make mountain bike trails in the backyard and have a little GoPro set up and started playing music when I was 16. learning how to figure out like a multi-track for making music I was like, oh, this is really cool. I'll keep doing this,, it's hard for me not to tinker and I get very obsessed on one thing, one track minded.

I don't think I love doing things the right way. I think I really enjoy [00:09:00] doing things like a more fun, creative way personally. , The building is such a quality example of that. Like, building the coop. My little truck camper I have on the back of my truck is so not built the right way. I cut corners a lot and I think that I would prefer to like learn the hard way rather than like go on YouTube or read a book about how to properly build and do it all to a t to where it's very perfect. But I almost feel like if my imperfections aren't in my product, then I don't feel as connected to the product that I create.

So the imperfections are dope, in my opinion.

Paddy: That makes a lot of sense, especially for somebody who seems like, so steadfast in their independence within their art.

Griff: That's a huge compliment too.

Paddy: Dude, I'm just

Griff: Just buttering

Paddy: You're a buttered Turkey. Wait, just wait. I found six ex-girlfriends to talk to you about and here they are.

Griff: oh my God. They're all in

Paddy: You are the father.

Griff: Damn it.

Pause Pause Pause

Paddy: Are some of your [00:10:00] earliest memories like, oh, I want to create this thing.

Like, where do you think that comes from?

Griff: Whoa. That's a great question. Hmm. Dang. I mean, the,, first thing that kind of comes mind is like my home life. My parents split when I was one. Don't remember much of that and growing up with my mom, my sister and my brother are so much older than me, they were already off in college.

So I was kind of raised like an only child. And my mom, , had a nine to five and, . I'd have like babysitters and stuff, but I just had a lot of time alone. So I think that I would spend that time outside building trails or , making little skate videos or skating in the street and things like that.

And I loved having a product after I did the thing, like having a, video of me landing that trick was almost better than landing the trick 'cause I get to go and put music to it and kind of relive it over and over again. On top of that, my dad lives in Chattanooga. And he works at like an kids camp.

So a camp you'd go to as a kiddo to go canoe and rock climb and do all those things. . So I think that's where the outdoor aspect comes into things. But I also had a lot of time [00:11:00] there 'cause I'd just be running around and he had a, camp to direct,

and I just kind of run around and have a bow and arrow and like do kiddo things, make teepees in the woods and stuff like that. So I think all that alone time was really helpful for me to just kinda stay busy creatively. and what a cool space in the summer to go be outside like that

Paddy: Oh yeah.

Griff: be creative outside's even cooler, you know.

So, ironically my parents got back together 16 years later.

Paddy: Really?,

Griff: yeah.

Paddy: this is like the, plot of a lovely rom-com.

Griff: I say we had nothing to do with it.

Paddy: Did you parent trap your parents?!

Griff: With the help my brother. Yes.

I had an acoustic coffee house show. I was like 16, 17. My dad came in town they had just kind of gotten out of relationships of their own and we're both single and they got to talking at this coffee table and then two years later they got remarried. It was

Paddy: You did Parent trap your parents, dude, this is, so, you're at the coffee shop and you're like, Hey, if we could dim the lights. This one's, this song goes out to my parents. It's called In Your Eyes by Peter Gabriel. .

Griff: [00:12:00] Yeah. Get them martinis please the

Paddy: PAUSE PAUSE PAUSE

many of your releases, your tunes are named after significant outdoor landmarks, Smith Rock, Iceland, Mount Bachelor, Mount Hood, Encinitas, Oregon Coast, or just simply the river.

You've said that the outdoors charge you up and that the experiences you have out there help you put, , this flow state like directly into the center of your skull for the next creation. Do you feel like you seek out outdoor adventures in order to fuel your music, or do you feel like the music comes almost as a byproduct of your desire to pursue those adventures?

Griff: Whoa. That's a huge one. I need to think about that one. I think it's not as romantic as seems on the eps. A lot of times I'll write the songs and the songs are already written

Paddy: Mm-hmm.

Griff: and then I'll go enjoy the place, which will maybe subconsciously inspire me to like, take all those songs and collectively put them together and slap the name on it.

occasionally one comes [00:13:00] up that's written in that place or around the timeframe of that place. I'm gonna make that a goal this year is to like go to the places and see what comes out of that place. I would love to. Create a trailer, like a mini tiny home that's just a studio, massive windows.

Make a movie out of it and tow it with the coop, put it in rad places, set up shop, live in that place, and just have that backspace as just a studio and like fully absorb the place. And, see what it's like to actually go, full fledge that idea and go to the place, write the song, see what comes out.

There's an EP called Iceland. And I would say half of those were written in that place because when I was filming with my buddies, Ben Sturgulewski and Ben Moon,

They're legends, they're great, great creatives. ,

Paddy: This is for the film creation theory,

Griff: yeah, I had to do a lot of sitting and playing as they would walk around with different cameras and fly drones and things like that. And I, just created the song Orcas when I was, uh, sitting there for them for the filming along with surfing and Iceland. I got that, the chord progression and went home and, and wrote that song. And those are to me like really special [00:14:00] songs. 'cause it takes me like right back to sitting. on this cliff face. And there's this little art cabin. There was a little lighthouse there and we got insane shots of the sunset . And I just discovered the chords so Love that. Wanna I wanna do more of that for sure.

MUSIC IN THE CLEAR FOR A BEAT

Paddy: Something about your creative process that is very, very intriguing to me, is that you said, my sound is created by having restrictions. What do you mean by that? How exactly do boundaries or borders help your art be more expansive?

Griff: I think that the spaces that I've chosen to create music in aren't very allowing of a ton of synths and instruments and, and stuff like that. I'm kind of restricted to a computer, a a little half size mid keyboard. A guitar if there's space. I have an electric guitar, but normally not. I kind of have to push myself creatively to find different sounds and go down different paths to write songs, because I can't be like, oh, this isn't working with guitar.

I'll just go to my 60th keyboard

Paddy: Let's [00:15:00] talk about those spaces, because you got a van in the fall of 2020. You also have not one, but two camper trucks. One of them, which features that handbuilt cabin, the coop, which is adorable.

Griff: Hilarious.

Paddy: It is so cute. You've lived in more than one tiny home and on more than one sailboat. you've also lived in a tour bus.

So basically if there's a form of itinerant non-traditional housing, you have been all up in that. You have squoozen in yourself into these small places. What do you love most about living in these small mobile environments? What is the appeal?

Griff: The ability to go anywhere I think is top of the list if I had my hand in creating it, that's. The second on the list, living amongst a space that you created. And it's a tangible thing. It's not just a song, but it's a space that surrounds you that's pretty incredible. , My tiny Home is by far the, favorite place I ever lived.

, Just designing a [00:16:00] shower that was a coat closet sized, you know, like putting a bathroom in that was like so fun. , Cramming a kitchen into one of the corners of the, little shed. Or where am I gonna put the music studio, it's so fun.

The sailboat for sure is like one of the coolest things I've ever discovered.

If the Weather provides that you can go anywhere that land touches sea, that's just insane to me and I still can't get over how incredible that is , I think that maybe there's a part of me that is attracted to like, cheating the system. ' cause that's why I started living in a small space I was living in New York, wanted to move to California to learn how to surf, , I was just kind of following the, track, you know, like move to New York to try to do music.

Okay, this isn't working. I'll move to LA to try to do music. I only lived in New York for three months for very obvious reasons. I just couldn't do it. It was way too tight of a space for me. Claustrophobia kicked in. and I wanted to move to California and, didn't wanna work as much as I had in New York to supply myself with.

An apartment. So I was like, well, I still have that car from high school, that Ford Explorer, , let me go get that for my parents. I'll drive it across the country. I think I can afford a [00:17:00] cot and like a little, blow up sleeping pad, and a Yeti. I think I'll just like live out that.

And that just like opened up this huge door for opportunity. Like, whoa, I don't have to work as much. I can play more, I can make more music. I can live anywhere that suits me at the time.

Paddy: what's interesting about that is that you just said you didn't like New York because it was too small. It felt too claustrophobic. And so instead you're like, well, , this studio Apartment's on wheels, though it has an engine, so it's small. Yes. But it moves so I can take it to places that are expansive. Is that the freedom of it? You're like, I don't mind small things. I just don't want to have the, inability to move that small thing.

Griff: Yeah, I've never thought of that. Yeah. Or maybe it's , the claustrophobia aspect comes of like, I'm stuck in the city and I can't move. When I leave my little apartment, I'm still squeezed in here and I still have to go to work. So maybe my like time felt kind of constricted as well.

'cause all I did was work to live.

Paddy: So then what do you not love about these mobile, sleeping arrangements [00:18:00] that you've made for yourself?

Griff: Living in California was tough in the car. . People aren't psyched on the fact that you live outta your car and they've spent millions of dollars to be where they are and you can just pull up, put the car in park, crawl in the backseat and call the same area home. So that was a little weird 'cause I felt unwanted in California.

got, notes left on my window saying like, I'm gonna call the police, don't sleep here again. , That stuff's not great.

Paddy: Getting the cops called on you. Yeah. No, that's not great.

Griff: sometimes the boat is a little bit rough 'cause you're on an island and your home just moves. It's not even like a grounded island, And if there's swell, which could be great 'cause the surf's pumping, but if there's swell, you're like, man, I just want a break.

You're like seasick in your own home, so sometimes that can be a drag,

PAUSE PAUSE PAUSE

The tiny home is so big. I mean, you, you're pushing the limit on the road's. 14 feet now is like 13 and three quarters. So. When I moved my tiny home from Washington to Oregon, I drove from, a washugal area, [00:19:00] which is like, Washington Gorge to the Oregon Gorge.

So I went across the bridge of the gods, which is this insane place. , Really skinny bridge, with very low overhang. I had a stick that was 14 feet, and I would park the car somewhere where I'd see like a low hanging branch, and I'd step out and take my massive two by two and put it in the ground and be like, okay, the tiny home can go this route.

And if it didn't, I'd have to go another way. So the tiny home was, it was less, , an explorative, vehicle for travel more so than like a way to live cheaply and live in a really creative space. , The camper, you can go anywhere you want, but , the sailboats just like ultimate freedom.

But that comes with its own struggles. Like the sailboat is so much work, it's so tough. you're just getting beat up the whole time. You're living on the boat fixing things. The swells rough. a lot of work to go do your laundry. It's like a full day's mission to go get groceries. You wake up at 3:00 AM 'cause the wind's howling and there's a squall and you gotta go make sure you're not dragging, or maybe you are, and you gotta deal with that. It's like you can't just [00:20:00] go to bed and wake up the next morning and worry. but for the most part, not feeling constricted to one place is, is pretty awesome.

Paddy: how do those experiences like show up in your music?

Like when you listen to certain tunes, do you hear a certain living situation? You know, you're like, ah, this sounds like the sailboat. Or like, ah, this sounds like the coop or the camper van or the tiny home.

Griff: I don't think so, but it's inspiring to be asked that question 'cause I think I want it to be, which kinda is, it's on par with how I want to be creating more, you know, I want to kind of be uncomfortable when I create. and I feel like a lot of times in the past year I'll sit down and just try to write what I think people want to hear, but I think from here on, and it's kind of in my new year's resolution to like be uncomfortable when I create,

Paddy: what's that uncomfortability look like You're like, I'm gonna get a nine to five office job and see what, see what happens. I am selling all of my tools. I shall not tinker. I won't look at a cardboard box.

Griff: You know what, Paddy? I [00:21:00] think I've got a job interview in like three minutes. I gotta go, man.

I gotta get my cardboard laptop out. I gotta be at the, know.

Paddy: The wifi on this thing is shit.

Griff: Yeah. I think for me, the discomfort is the space. You know, I, I live in a house most of the time nowadays, and that's been a big jump for me. , I have a studio that doesn't move. It's always there and just. Down the stairs, I can make another coffee or sit down on the couch and like watch YouTube or watch a movie or something.

the distractions of the comforts around me are, way too strong and I think that I need to get outta my comfort zone of my specific house and I'm kind of recognizing these days that the spaces had a huge part in the music that I was creating. And it really helped me to step outside of what do the fans want? What does my manager want? What does the label want? What does what's gonna help me grow as a musician?

PADDY VO:

More adventurin' and creativity expansion and contraction from Griff Goth Babe Washburn after the break.

MIDROLL MIDROLL MIDROLL MIDROLL

Paddy: Do I have this [00:22:00] correct?

You learned how to sail by watching YouTube videos?

Griff: I did.

Paddy: Okay. This is insane to me. I have used YouTube University for many things. Mostly though, it's like, how do I replace the headlight on my Subaru? Where does this loose wing nut go on my washing machine? Not how do I navigate by stars on open water or repair a boat hull?

Take me through learning to sale on YouTube.

Griff: Well, I will give some credit, a lot of credit to two friends of mine, Brett and Ethan, they both were sailors. , One was a Liverboard kind of taught me how to live on a sailboat. then Brett's just grew up sailing. He took me out once or twice and kind of showed me the ropes. But YouTube, yeah, I had a brain injury at the time from a surfing accident that put me out of a lot. Concerts, took me out of a lot of things. , I was just kind of curled up on a couch in San Diego and I stayed down there 'cause there was a lot of care that I could go do, you know, visits and [00:23:00] have help, have people that would help me with my brain.

But I had a lot of time to just do nothing and watch tv. And I just stumbled upon YouTube videos and, uh, became so fascinated and it just led to like, holy crap. I just texted a guy on Craigslist to go look at a boat and then I got a really cheap boat on Craigslist and was like, okay, I think I can do this.

Was like, I'm gonna go to Mexico in this boat and got a boat in San Francisco. And Brett and another friend of mine, Maddie, she and him helped me sail the boat to San Diego. And you do one big passage and I feel like you learn a lifetime, , versus just going in and outta the harbor, learning how to sail your boat.

You sleep on the boat. For three days, you know, the passage is 400 miles and you can only sail 98, 95 miles in 1 24 hour period. So you learn pretty quick how to read the weather, how to trim your sails accordingly to what the weather's doing, whose shift is it so the crew can sleep? You're making food in a really rough environment.

How far are you offshore? getting a sail past. Big Sur, like 10 miles offshore was one [00:24:00] of the most insane, holy cow. This is crazy experiences in my life. it was blowing maybe 25 knots all day, maybe 20 knots. And you got big sir to your left, and it was cool, man. And that's where it was like, all right, this is, this is the coolest thing I've ever done.

I wanna do more of

Paddy: What was the most surprising thing about being on the open water?

Griff: Two things. The first being my body was not ready for being offshore. . You're at least 3, 4, 5 miles away from land. For multiple days. I got very, very sick, you know, once we went under the Golden Gate Bridge and we took that hard left to go south I got so sick and was like, oh, I, I think I'm feeling better now. And Brett at the time was like, no, you're not. This, this is gonna last a

Paddy: Were you like, holy shit, I gotta return this boat 'cause it makes me wanna vomit.

Griff: I had thoughts totally Paddy. I was like, did, am I built for this? Is this really what I want to do? 'cause this is gnarly. And being seasick is something I wouldn't wish upon my worst enemy if I had one. I would never, [00:25:00] ever want to anyone else to experience that. It's terrible. it's like flu times five.

But the second thing was that I went into it thinking this is gonna be terrifying. Like, this is so scary. We're 7, 8, 9 miles off shore. But it's a kind of a comforting feeling being out there.

Paddy: Really?

Griff: there's a force of nature that's freaky, but it's also kind of peacefully humbling., After that trip, I'd be on the beach in San Diego and I'd see, nav light's off the coast and it'd be the sun's going down or it's nighttime, and you're like, they're probably sailing off shore going somewhere and thinking, man, that sounds so peaceful being out there right now.

And I don't know if it has anything to do with leaving expectations and. Just concerns and ego and any of that stuff on the shore. Maybe it's why people do drugs or like they get to leave all the scary parts of life behind and kind of like escape. It's kind of like a real life escape where you're out there and you just have to focus on trimming your sails.

don't sink the boat, get to where you need to go,

have you fed yourself? When are you sleeping? You, you kind of go down to the basic necessities [00:26:00] of humanity, of like keeping yourself alive. it's humbling. It's

I think it'd be really cool to go up to Newfoundland and explore colder water sailing and kind of open that can of worms.

Paddy: dude.

Griff: There's surf waves. No one surfs like. Death's on the, on, on the table. That's in the cards.

But it's like, all right, I gotta, I gotta get on back on YouTube. Let's go sailing some more. Let's learn some more. And,, uh, not sink or die. So

Paddy: Jesus

PAUSE PAUSE PASUE

In addition to sailing, A lot of the sports that you do seem to me to like really amp up your heart but surfing kind of seems to me like your soul sport, surfing also, like you just mentioned, has, brought you a bit of challenge and pain.

After you crashed and you got a concussion, you were driving up to Utah, your brain swelled, you had some major, extended post-concussion issues. Can you tell me about the impact that that [00:27:00] had on your life, your health, and your career?

Griff: The brain injury was, it's an injury that's invisible to everyone else, you're like so deeply suffering on the inside.

Paddy: Hmm.

Griff: it's a scary, scary thing. I've always valued my life so much and I've always been so incredibly psyched for the next adventure that I've, never had the thoughts of like leaving life behind, but when you have a brain injury, it's like, you know, the only life we have is between our two ears.

Like, this world is just perceived right here.

Paddy: Hmm.

Griff: And if it's hindered any way you could. Do the coolest adventure in the world, but if you hurt, then it's like there's no use in being there. Coming out of, it just made me really appreciate having normalcy, like having just a healthy head on my shoulders.

Being able to have an hour and a half podcast and not go into it with dizziness and excruciating migraine and be like, ah, Paddy, we gotta cut this short. It really brings you to the basics of, of [00:28:00] life. and I think the head injury too also kind of pushed me to go sailing.

You know, I was beginning to get better and just wanted to explore as much of, uh, central America as I could while I could. 'cause you never know what's gonna happen tomorrow,

Paddy: Did you get those, lingering post-concussive, effects under control, like the brain fog, the dizziness, the migraines, the all of the things. Are those now under control or are they still around?

Griff: they're under control, which is so cool to say.

Paddy: Wow. Awesome.

Griff: did a bunch of different therapies. There's like a magnetic therapy that I did on my brain that would, shoot like magnetic, like pulses to try to realign my brainwaves from like the back of my brain to the prefrontal cortex. that made things way worse.

Paddy: Oh shit.

Griff: yeah. Now I'm like, why did I do that? But you had people in, in your ear and they're like, this, I can heal you

Paddy: Yeah. Yeah,

Griff: give you the treatment for free.

Paddy: Uh, uh

Griff: chiropractic stuff made things a lot worse for me. , Mushrooms had a huge impact [00:29:00] on my brain. I don't know if we're allowed to talk about that on here, but psilocybin therapy

Paddy: can talk about that.

Griff: It was in a legal state. I used psilocybin therapy to microdose for a little while. That helped kind of regulate normalcy a little bit, helped kind of take care of some dizziness, , and anxiety. 'cause anxiety affects the brain in pretty negative ways. , but I did a couple bigger experiences with psilocybin and I think if it didn't help my brain, it really just put a different perspective on.

I. My relationship to my injury. And I think that was really powerful okay, if I don't get better from this, that's okay. You know, I'm, I'm, I can live with this. But the biggest thing that helped me, which it's so crazy that it, it hasn't really been studied, is, trigger point therapy was what healed the lasting effects of my brain injury.

Paddy: Is that the, pressure therapy on the, sacrum?

Griff: Part of it. Yeah, totally.

I'm not a specialist in this stuff and I would definitely recommend doing your own research, but we have like sarcomeres and we have muscle fibers that oxygen can't quite get to those muscles because of an injury, [00:30:00] because of anxiety provoking.

Muscles to tense up. Maybe we're sleeping on it wrong, maybe we've overused it, maybe it's a posture thing. And you have these little, areas of your muscle that aren't getting blood flow and oxygen but if you squeeze or you, you put pressure, that allows oxygen and blood to get back to that part of that muscle. And what's crazy about trigger points is that they induce referred pain. So like if I'm ha having excruciating migraines, I would never think to, look for a trigger point in the back of my head or my traps.

Or the biggest one for me wa, was my stern Otto mastoid muscle on my neck. after a brain injury, your neck and your shoulders and all these different parts leading up to your head will tense to try to protect your head.

and over time, if they've just been so constricted for months, years, in my case, you have headaches all the time.

so debilitating and there's so many expensive ways to deal with headaches that I, I went through so many different, western medication [00:31:00] therapies, try and heal my, my headaches alone, but they didn't fix it except for trigger point therapy.

Paddy: How did the injury in the recovery process change your relationship with the sport? Did you have to kind of put it on the mantle for a while? And if so, how did it feel to get back in the water?

Griff: I think A lot of trauma came with the head injury 'cause you're like, wow, like this could just happen again and it's gonna be twice as worse as it's been. You know? 'cause head injuries, you get them easier the more you've had them and they're, you know, make it worse the next time. So there was a lot of stress surfing.

If it wasn't more of a physical pain, it was like, oh my God, I don't really wanna do this, so am I really having fun doing this? So it took me a long time to not worry about opinions about looking cool about. I don't think I've, I've gotten anything done by worrying about looking cool. So I'm really proud of myself for what I did. But I bought a helmet and I started surfing with a helmet, and I have just loved surfing.

I'm able to do it again and have a great time, and it's been a personal journey, like paddling out in the lineup and [00:32:00] being the only one with this massive helmet on, and you feel like a dork, but I'm not there to shred. I'm not really a shredder. I'm there to have fun, and I

Paddy: Well, feeling cool is, is better than looking cool, I think. You know,

Griff: true, right? Yeah.

Paddy: like, you know, and it's like I can't get the feeling I'm after if I'm on the beach watching other people surf. But was there a day for you when you went back post-injury into the water and you were like, ah, I'm back baby.

Griff: Yeah, in San Diego. There's a surf spot called Pipes there, which is just south of Swami Swamis. It's kind of a popular break in Encinitas in North County, San Diego. And, I, surfed there with some friends and the sun was setting, and I wrote the song Taking Over the Sun about that.

And there's a line that says like, I surf until the sun died. It's good to be back. I'm grateful for where I'm at today. And granted, I still was dealing with a lot of symptoms, but it was like, oh man, just get little, little sprinkles of Normalities. Like, you just, you take it and you're so psyched on it.

PAUSE PAUSE PAUSE PAUSE MUSIC IN THE CLEAR

Paddy: Well, I've had to do a lot of things for [00:33:00] work while being injured, but writing an essay or chatting with someone in front of a microphone, is a hell of a lot different than playing a show in front of hundreds or thousands of people. Performing music during this stretch when you were injured must have been its own special form of torture.

Griff: Mm,

Paddy: Did the outdoors provide any relief during this time or was going outside its own form of torture?

Griff: everything kind of sucked. Uh, the only thing that wouldn't suck would be like meditating. So I would go out in the woods and just get some quiet and meditate just to try to like combat the symptoms. , The shows were definitely pretty tough, that made the head injury tough. I think it exacerbated it and last make it, made it last a lot longer.

And you know, sometimes I look back at it and I'm a little bit bummed that I didn't take the opportunity to play more shows that I was offered. I had to turn down a lot of really awesome opportunities because of the head injury. but, you know, I think what [00:34:00] was more important was like what I learned from having an injury and having to turn shows down.

And to be able to come back healthy and say yes to shows and want to do them and be psyched to do them

Paddy: what was that lesson?

Griff: I love the job that I have and I am so blessed to be able to do what I'm doing today. And I may be pre-injury. You just, maybe there's entitlement being a young musician and you just are like, oh, I, you know, of course I got offered this show, or I don't really wanna do that.

And then you come outta the injury and you're like, oh, well I had the opportunity where I couldn't do this

Paddy: Was it like a sense of humbleness and gratitude?

Griff: gratitude, that's the word. That's a single word. Yeah. Gratitude. Like I could have had so many other jobs, I could have worked in construction with a head injury and like it would've sucked. And I get to come back and play music. It's like, are you kidding me? I got the easiest job in the world. Like, there's no sense of complaining and turning down shows when it could be so much worse, you know?

Paddy: Just like there was that day that you had in San Diego surfing, was there a day that you had on stage where you were like, I'm good. [00:35:00] I'm back, baby.

Griff: Yeah. Lollapalooza, which is funny 'cause that show I turned down, I turned down Lollapalooza three months after my initial head injury in 2021. And,

Paddy: That is a very big time show. And as a Chicago and as a Chicago guy, a Super Rad show

Griff: I mean, dude, skyline behind it's, it's insane. That was the show and a two years later, I could play it. Maybe it was a year and a half later, and

Paddy: And you're, you're, you're probably playing to what, like 60,000 people or something?

Griff: no, I think,

Paddy: 100 million thousand people.

Griff: yes, I was gonna correct you, but I'm glad you said it.

Paddy: actual, real number, how many people were in the crowd?

Griff: Between like six and 10, maybe.

Paddy: That's an insane amount of humans. I mean, it's, it's no 100 trillion billion jagillion, but that's a shiitake mushroom full of humans.

Griff: a lot of people. Yeah, and I think I mentioned it too. I was like, guys. Thank you for coming to my set. It's all put in [00:36:00] perspective and I'm grateful to be here and thank you for like walking to my set and this is cool kind of vibe.

PAUSE PAUSE PAUSE PAUSE

Paddy: What would your music sound like? Say if you stayed in Nashville or Memphis, or if you hunkered down in Brooklyn, or when you moved to la you stayed there. What do you think the focus on the music would sound like? What happens to Goth babe then?

Griff: I think that the outdoors return you to your base self. I think they allow you to really be the best version of Griff or Pa There's not much distraction and you're able to kind of. See what's going on inside. in Los Angeles and in New York and in Nashville there was music industry people, or even before out there was just music cliquey people, you know, bands that dress cool and you, you know, you're opening for them and you want to be like them.

Stuff like that. I think that I would have a much different sound. I probably would've been writing music that I assume people want to hear or what I think would get me success. But it wasn't until moving to Los Angeles kind of beginning to go down the road of like, not successful [00:37:00] musician, but like someone who has a career in music in LA and was like, ah, this isn't really what I thought it would be.

And just did the car thing full time, surf full time. And I think then I just wrote music for fun. So it was the ocean, it was the outdoors that returned me to like. The same Griff that wrote music when he first picked up a guitar at 16. Just way better, you know, way, way better music. 'cause I can play the instruments better and I've had that time to kind of master my craft.

But, the outdoors breeds authenticity at which translates into my music in so many ways.

Paddy: So then is the key to your life and your art always travel in some form, whether physically or emotionally? Always search.

Griff: Yeah, I love that. I'm gonna text you in a couple years Paddy and be like, finally made that cabin finally making music out in the woods and

Paddy: I made a cabin on a pontoon with a sail, and it's amazing.

Griff: I have thought of doing that actually. I'm not kidding. I'm not

Paddy: of course. You have, uh, this next [00:38:00] album, the baseline is actually, , the ocean lapping on the pontoon boat.

Griff: Oh yeah. The outdoors returns you to your, to your happy place returns you to, who you really are. I think there's no, like, there's no faking it out there.

Paddy: Well, I'm so happy that you're in your happy place because we, the audience get to listen to that. And guess what, man? Your happy place sounds pretty frigging sweet.

Griff: Thanks

Paddy: nice soundtrack there, man.

Griff: Legend. Thanks dude.

MUSIC IN THE CLEAR FOR A BEAT

Paddy: It is time for the final ramble, one piece of gear that you cannot live without.

Griff: It's gotta be a lightweight, puffy coat. It's the most granols thing I could possibly say, but that is the most universal jacket. you can put it in your suitcase, forget about it, cram it in your backpack, forget about it. It will keep you warmer than your cotton. it's amazing.

Paddy: Did not see that coming I would've thought like, speed square skill saw level, you know,

best outdoor snack.

Griff: indoor or outdoor trader Joe's peanut butter cups, dark [00:39:00] chocolate.

Paddy: Dude, those things are so dangerous. Are you going the full peanut butter cups or the minis? The like tic-tac size that you can just, you can eat a handful and it's okay because they're so wee,

Griff: I go big for the danger of the minis and I have to eat the bigs in half and then eat just so I can savor. I do two at a time. Oh, so good.

Paddy: So good. Good call. What is your hottest outdoor hot take?

Griff: I hope I don't get a bunch. I. Of hate for this.

Paddy: boy. I like it already. Ooh, this is gonna be mas caliente.

Griff: I don't like hiking. I just don't,

Paddy: Oh my God.

Griff: where I'm like, adventure, adventure, adventure. Next thing, next thing, next thing,

Paddy: yeah,

Griff: hiking. I'm like, well, what are we walking to do? What are we, why aren't, why don't we have our bikes? Why aren't we mountain biking?

Paddy: yeah, yeah.

Griff: like,

Paddy: is the Woo-hoo.

There has be something, you hiking.

I, I, I get so tired.

OUTRO VO:

Griff Washburn is Goth Babe. Check out Griff's music videos and adorable DIY tinkering videos on his YouTube channel, [00:40:00] Goth Babe Music. Creation Theory, the mindbending film Griff created music for, is all over the interwebs. And you can watch, Lola, the shortfilm detailing his life, music, and sailing adventures and find out about concerts near you on his website Goth Babe Music dot com. His instagram is, you guessed it, Goth Babe Music. And do yourself a favor, go buy his music wherever you buy music. "Buy" being the important word there. You'll surely groove and feel real nice.

And sidenote: Lovely listening audience members, we want to hear about the appetites of your earholes. So email us guest nominations and your thoughts on the show to ¹ú²ú³Ô¹ÏºÚÁÏ Podcast At ¹ú²ú³Ô¹ÏºÚÁÏ Inc Dot Com. This show is baked up specifically for you and the satisfaction of the sound munchers on the side of your noodle. Those are your ears.

The ¹ú²ú³Ô¹ÏºÚÁÏ Podcast is hosted and produced by me, [00:41:00] Paddy O'Connell. But you can call me PaddyO. The show is also produced by storytelling wizard, Micah "Just like Goth Babe. I surf at Pipes a few times a week and I wanted you to know that" Abrams. Music and Sound Design by Robbie Carver. And booking and research by Maren Larsen.

The ¹ú²ú³Ô¹ÏºÚÁÏ Podcast is made possible by our ¹ú²ú³Ô¹ÏºÚÁÏ Plus members. Learn about all the extra rad benefits and become a member yourself at ¹ú²ú³Ô¹ÏºÚÁÏ Online Dot Com Slash Pod Plus.